Today I’m talking to Amber Williams the Chief Executive Officer of the Resolution Institute. The institute is the largest dispute resolution membership organisation across Australia and New Zealand. In this discussion we cover what the Resolution Institute is and what's happening in the world of dispute resolution including developments in accreditation, restorative practice and where you can access training in the various dispute resolution disciplines.
Topics covered include
Working for a member organisation vs a corporate organisation.
How did you become the CEO of Resolution Institute?
What’s the accreditation situation for mediators in New Zealand?
What other forms of dispute resolution practitioners are there and what standards exist to regulate them?
Expert determination and accreditation (what is it and how migth you become one)?
The role of mediation and legal practice in dispute resolution.
The role of restorative practice in Australia and New Zealand.
What else is emerging in the practice of dispute resolution or what is happening at the Resolution Institute that might interest listeners?
James Judge 0:11
Welcome to the people and culture podcast with me, James judge. Today I'm talking to Amber Williams, the CEO of the Resolution Institute. The Institute is the largest dispute resolution membership organisation across Australia and New Zealand. I've personally been a member since 2011 as a mediator, but the organisation also has a range of other types of dispute resolution practitioners as members, including conciliators, arbitrators, adjudicators and restorative justice practitioners. To find out some more about the resolution Institute, and what's happening in the world of dispute resolution. Let's talk to Amber. Amber, thanks for joining me today.
Amber Williams 0:53
You're welcome. It's great to be speaking with you.
James Judge 0:57
Prior to becoming the CEO of the Resolution Institute, a couple of years ago, you were the CEO of a New South Wales commission, and also a Chief Human Resources Officer for the New South Wales Department of Justice. How different is working for a member based organisation like the institute compared to a corporate role.
Amber Williams 1:16
It's both similar and different. And I'll elaborate a little bit on that, I think, to say, first off, I absolutely love working in a member organisation. This is obviously the first member base for all that I've done. And for me, it has been a huge eye opener in terms of the potential of organisations like ours, and of our members and people who work on the front line of whether it's dispute resolution, or whatever I mean, based organisation might be doing. So for me stepping into this role, it was a huge learning curve. And I did it just before the first lockdown of COVID. So that was not necessarily the easiest thing to do learn, learn a new role in your organisation, and deal with COVID. But in saying that, for me, it has been really kind of refreshing to be able to work on the frontline in a sense with our members. So being able to hear from people who work in the industry firsthand, and being able to respond to that and advocate for them. And for the caucus dispute resolution community really quickly, through the last three years has been really important. And I think resolution Institute has played a big role in that period of time. If I compare that to my corporate role, I think both are really meaningful as well and bring different challenges. But I think for me, the corporate role is great in that it teaches you really strong governance. And it taught me how to work within boundaries of for government, in particular bureaucracy and the different levels of delegation and empowerment and the decision making, which because you're spending taxpayers money, you have to really be cognizant of what state they are stepping into resolution Institute, we work for the members. So it's and we talk to the members about what we're doing, they have input into our strategic plan, and things can get done much more quickly. And I really love that. So I guess for me, it's I've taken the strengths of my past careers, because I think they are somewhat different. And then bringing it and working in this environment is absolutely fabulous. So yeah, having lots of fun.
James Judge 3:48
Was it 2019? I think when you became the CEO, it was just prior to COVID. right?
Amber Williams 3:52
Yeah, it was at the very end of 2019. So I think I started in the last week of November, from memory.
James Judge 4:02
Dispute resolution has often been seen as a type of activity or a set of skills connected to the legal profession. I mean, I did my initial mediator training through leader, which was one of the institute's forebears, which at that time, had a strong lawyer membership base, but dispute resolution has grown remarkably, over the last few decades. So tell me a bit about the range of members that institute now has and the sorts of diverse work that they're involved in.
Amber Williams 4:29
Yeah, this is interesting. We have as you mentioned, in 2015, we became resolution Institute and prior to that we were leader, which stood for lawyers engaged in ADR and I m which was the Institute of arbitrators and mediators Australia. So we have a historically very strong, strong history with having large loyal base membership, and we're still in touch with that. However, as you mentioned, Since that time, and I think as leader in particular progressed, that membership did diversify significantly. We have people who come from all over the place. So there are a very large population of family dispute resolvers and family lawyers that work. And our members in resolution Institute, we have people from construction, education, environment, people who specialise in environmental disputes, and then think about what's emerging now. And I guess with COVID, working in small business, so they're the small business disputes, and the small business Commission's were really busy over the last couple of years, and then the late retail leasing and tenancy disputes have just skyrocketed. So there is such a wide range of what our members now do. And they come from all sorts of, of areas. So whether they were lawyers, so and I'll give you some stats, sorry to jump around here.
James Judge 6:01
But you know, please, please don't yell out,
Amber Williams 6:03
I think it's, I'm gonna give you some approximates, it's not exact numbers, because it changes weekly, but I think almost 90% of our members are qualified or accredited, or practising and dispute resolution across the spectrum of those 90%. Almost 40% are legally qualified or, or come from legal backgrounds. So that's still a strong portion, but they do practice across different industries. So we have people, in addition to that, who come from social work and psychology, particularly in that family space, and community space, we have people who come from construction directly. So architects and builders and engineers, who are really involved in the adjudication and arbitration, areas of dispute resolution, and then what's been emerging recently is a growth in financial and accounting based disputes. And what I mean by that is in the expert determination area, so we have been requested to nominate expert determiners in whether it's property or valuation based disputes, where they need an accounting based expert determiner, so that's new for us as well. And that's, that's a really fast growing area that we've seen recently that we are really excited about. So yeah, we have a huge diversity in our membership. And one that we see is our biggest strengths. So it's really exciting to be able to talk to such vast different people in my role. One day, I'm talking to a family lawyer the other next day, I'm talking to an architect, so it's fantastic.
James Judge 7:38
Expert, determinaters expert? That's the one I struggle with. Yeah, expert, determiners.
Amber Williams 7:44
Yes, I quite often say expert derterminators, and I don't want to get stuck in my head. It's stuck there.
James Judge 7:50
I know that in Australia, we have a national mediator accreditation system, which sets up practice standards for mediators. And there's a real focus here on training, assessing an accrediting of mediators. I know having having been through that process myself, is that also the case in New Zealand? Because I know again, when I first joined the organisation, it was LEADR and then IAMA and you joined and then expanded, I think, into New Zealand, what's the situation like over there?
Amber Williams 8:16
Good question, actually NMAS or the the accreditation system that is here in Australia that's governed by the Mediator Standards Board, that doesn't exist in New Zealand, or what does exist in New Zealand is the equivalent to what LEADR accreditation was here in Australia and LEADR in New Zealand, which is part of Resolution Institute created many, many years ago. So we're still training and accrediting mediators in New Zealand. And we have about 390 members there who are all facilitative. So that predominantly is mediators and restorative justice practitioners. Those standards, in a sense, are created and managed and governed by the Resolution Institute in New Zealand. So we're the leading organisation for training mediators in New Zealand, which is really exciting. But it is different to Australia. The training, however, that we provide is quite similar because the skills to be mediator don't change whether you're in New Zealand or Australia, the context might. So we still have a five day mediation programme in New Zealand as we do in Australia, the assessment process is very similar. So we adopt a similar principles in New Zealand as we do here in Australia, so that our mediators across both sides of the Tasman are equally as rigorously checked, trained and keep up with their CPD and, and so you have that kind of consistent level of quality of practitioners, which I think is really important.
James Judge 9:43
So there is no accreditation system, but the way they're trained and the process of facilitative mediation that they do there, if I was a business or someone wanting to procure the services of a mediator, it'd be a similar sort of experience in terms of the training and the approach whether it's in New Zealand Australia. Okay...
Amber Williams 10:00
Exactly. So we would still accredit mediators in New Zealand, but they would be Resolution Institute accredited rather than being enmasse accredited.
James Judge 10:10
Now there was a review of the mediator accreditation system here. We chatted about its findings last year, one of the key recommendations from that review, and what can we expect to see change in Australia at least? Look,
Amber Williams 10:23
I think that that's a really good question. And I have recently joined the Mediator Standards Board. So that's an that's come at a really important time, especially for Resolution Institute members. And if I put my RI hat on, the review is still underway. And I know the board is still drafting the new standards, which will be released very shortly, but there are a number of recommendations that were made that I think will shape the the next version of those standards, there is an increased focus on professionalising mediation, so rather than so we can say it's a profession. And what I mean in that is really increasing the rigour around and the governance and oversight of mediators and, and the role that the Mediator Standards Board plays in that. So I think some of the things that we can expect to see changes in the training of mediators and the accreditation processes with the Mediator Standards Board. So what I mean by that are organisations like Resolution Institute who train and accredit on behalf of the Mediator Standards Board will have to do I expect a review of all of our training processes, all of our accreditation and assessment to make sure that that higher level of standard is met, so that we can still train on behalf of an accredit on behalf of Mediator Standards Board. And also I understand there will be a number of levels of accreditation. So at the moment, you train, you do the five day course, you become do the assessment, and then you do a number of other things, get professional indemnity insurance, etc. And you become a mediator, I understand that there will be different level. So there'll be an advanced mediation, which resolution Institute already offers as well. There'll be specialist mediation or specialist accreditations. And I think they're looking to bring in more formally the FDR approach, but also to bring in conciliation as well. So that will be I think you're really exciting for members being able to see I guess, more of a pathway for them based on their stage of of their mediation, career and journey. But I think for me, it's really exciting to see what comes next, the review was really comprehensive, and there was a lot to digest from it, especially coming in to the Mediator Standards Board at the very back end of that process and seeing the work that's already been done.
Amber Williams 10:42
What about other forms of dispute resolution, or types of practitioners apart from mediators? So we you mentioned conciliators, I find it very hard. I mean, I teach dispute resolution at university level, and just trying to explain to students the difference between Mediation and Conciliation. And sometimes it just depends on what what a particular Act says. So, you know, in industrial relations environment, it might be called conciliation and then another Act might set out a process and it's called mediation. What other forms of dispute resolution practitioners are there and what standards exist to regulate them?
Amber Williams 13:23
This is a really good question. And I'm going to have humbly brag here, if you don't mind. Resolution Institute really leads the way in setting the standards of excellence for all the different types of disk or specialties of dispute resolution across the spectrum from the facility have to determine at events, they do exist. So I can talk you through a couple of those. So Resolution Institute over the last 12 months has implemented a conciliation framework. So that was done through a committee after the the adrak report, which was conciliation connecting the dots that was released a couple of years ago now. So we took that and thought, Well, what next and through that committee, we created a training and accreditation framework, which we are now accrediting conciliators. They're similar skills in some set some ways to mediators. It's just how you apply those skills and the role that the conciliator plays within the legislative framework and what that looks like. So we highlight the differences between Mediation and Conciliation, when you might need to use which skills and how to apply that. So that's one area so whatever happens in the mediator standards, our credited conciliators will be, I guess, already leading the way and ready to kind of fit into that framework. We also have arbitration and that's been in in place for for many years through IMR through a joint venture they have with the University of Adelaide, so they have a personal professional certificate. To get in arbitration, and then to become a graded on credited arbitrator with resolution Institute, you also need to meet other requirements. So those standards also exist in and you can get a formal qualification in that which many of our members do. Some of them use it to practice, but some of them just use it for the information and to help increase their knowledge in dispute resolution to be better practitioners. And then there's obviously expert determination, which is also relatively new and something that we've had in place for 18 months. So we now have approximately 70 accredited expert determiners. And they also need to meet a very rigorous standard go through assessments provide us with both written assessments and panel interview. So each really high level of standard required so that if you say, I'm using a resolution Institute accredited person that you know, you're getting someone who has been tested within an inch of their life. So it's really, really exciting. And then over the ditch in New Zealand, we have, we provide the restorative justice, training and accreditation on behalf of New Zealand government. So again, very strong standards required for that, because it's such a high risk environment that those practitioners are working in. So yeah, really broad spectrum, then obviously, there's the family dispute resolution qualification, which is run through the AGs. department. So yeah, it's a really I think, those standards do exist in different ways. But I think that's one of the things that we we hold dear to our heart, and as an organisation really focused on keeping the standards of excellence at that high level.
James Judge 16:40
Speaking of restorative justice, I don't think there is any regulatory framework or standards in Australia, at least that I know of is that right? I mean, it sounds like New Zealand's leading the way in that area. Yes?
Amber Williams 16:53
And that's that's a good question. We You're right. In Australia, there are different I guess, jurisdictional frameworks across different state governments and how how restorative practitioners are engaged and what they actually practising, whether it's youth or circle conferencing in indigenous communities, it's really differs from state to state. And there is no one set standard of practitioner, that's something that Resolution Institute is looking to change. And we look at it from both a restorative justice and restorative practice perspective. So restorative practices, because the broader application of those skills in other environments, but it's, it's really something, I think there's a huge opportunity here in Australia to, to take the lead from our New Zealand counterparts and, and use our knowledge and experience from those members and those who practice here in Australia and set that standard. So that is something that our board is currently looking at at the moment, and I'll be able to hopefully talk to you more about that shortly. Oh, interesting.
James Judge 17:57
Yeah. I mean, I first came across restorative practice, when my daughter was a primary school in Sydney, and the school said, Look, we're a restorative justice school. And as a mediator. I thought that's interesting. I better have a look at that.
Amber Williams 18:10
Yeah, restorative practice has so much potential and so much power. And even if you're a mediator practising in, say, the workplace, and you're looking at how do we resolve this situation, if you're just looking at it as a mediator and I'm putting very high levels and generalisations here, but the dollar outcomes or the working arrangements or whatever it might be - the focus on relationships, which is in a really important part of mediation by taking that restorative mindset and thinking, Well, how do we repair this? How does a victim of, whether it's workplace bullying or whatever it might be, have a say in the restorative process here for the benefit of all has such power. And I think it's heavily underutilised here in Australia. So something that we can talk more about and really educate people about whether it's in school or in health and the police. So if I think about it, from my law enforcement conduct commission perspective, taking that restorative approach between families or, I guess, people who feel wronged by police, it has such potential power. So yeah, I'm probably preaching to the converted. But it's it's such an exciting area.
James Judge 19:30
Look, I haven't seen it run in conjunction with, having done a few workplace mediations, in that context. I mean, conflict coaching is something that often gets added on there. So I can, it's really interesting to see how that could work, potentially as an adjunct with something like facilitative mediation. Going back to dispute resolution and legal practice for a minute, I've seen a number of studies that point to you know, 5% of civil law matters where court proceedings commence actually ending up at trial. So what this means is that 95% or so, of these civil conflicts are dealt with through some other form of dispute resolution. What are you seeing happen here in the field of legal education or the legal profession to address this issue?
Amber Williams 20:18
That is something that we've been talking a lot about here at resolution Institute over the last, say, 18 months or so, in university level, from what I understand now, our dispute resolution subjects, whether it's mediation or arbitration, in those courses, however, I don't think it's enough. And it's not mandatory in many of them. So for example, last week, I was down at University of Melbourne talking to the JD class who were in their last last lecture of their whole course, which was mediation. So we're talking to them about mediation as a career, and what that means and how you can also practice law, but have the mediation skills, because you're going to need to be a better advocate or lawyer. Understanding mediation is really important these days. And I don't think you can go into that profession without really understanding that from my end, I'm a purist. So of course, I would say that, but I know most universities have a similar subject. But I think there is an opportunity to make that more of a mandatory subject, because it is a growing part of the legal profession. Many of the courts mandate mediation, if you look at the county court in Victoria, and what they have done recently, not only encouraging mediation, but they're also put in an arbitration scheme. So for matters under $300,000, in their commercial area, they're now actively encouraging those parties not to wait for their court date, but to go in using a low cost arbitration model to resolve their disputes quickly. So they can just get on with life, rather than spending more waiting for the court to make a decision, which ultimately would have probably been the same thing that they got through an arbitration process. So courts are changing. And I think legal practitioners also need to change with them. And it is different whether you're representing a party in a mediation, I don't think you can do that without understanding the mediation process itself. If you go in there in an adversarial way, you're not going to, you're not going to succeed in that situation. And I think it's really important education for people currently practising as well.
James Judge 22:28
It's a different mindset, isn't it, as well as a different approach. What else are you seeing emerging in the practice of dispute resolution? Or what's happening at the Resolution Institute that might interest listeners?
Amber Williams 22:40
Look, there's a couple of things. I think, if you think about the broad world of dispute resolution, one of the things that is really exciting here in Australia, and in New Zealand is the expectation of family dispute resolution. And so mediators in that family environment over the recent years, the family court here in Australia, they've mandated mediation for a long time, but they are actively trying to push matters out of the court, out of the judges books into mediation and relying on that. And over in New Zealand, they're looking at child inclusive practice and what that means for family dispute resolvers. So things are changing in that space. And I think for Resolution Institute, we, as one of the I guess, the largest bodies representing FDRs, have a responsibility to offer a broader spectrum of CPD, and support and resources to those members so that they can be supported through those changes. They're really positive changes. It's just how, I guess now it's the next steps of saying, you're an FDR. What next? How do we support you? The other thing, I think is that restorative practice, work that our board is very focused on at the moment, as to what is our role? How do we use the learnings from New Zealand and apply them here in Australia, particularly in the First Nations communities? I know, the circle sentencing and group conferencing is really powerful in some of the courts here, mediation in the indigenous communities using the diamond model, is that the right thing to do, that's something that we also need to explore. And that is something that our diversity committee is looking at now as well. So were really looking at kind of that, what next mediation itself, the skills, the attributes, etc, that's been dealt with by the Mediator Standards Board. So we're looking at that kind of how do you then become more advanced in your practice and what does Resolution Institute do to help you continue that development in the determinative space, the profession, the certificate in arbitration continues to evolve. So we're running that next year with the University of Adelaide. And that course has recently been overhauled to keep up with, I guess, the changes in the environment. But we're also looking at an accreditation for expert witnesses so that we can have a pipeline for expert determiners. And there is a, I guess, a standard for expert witnesses here in Australia, whether it's expert witnesses in arbitration, or in the court itself, making sure that those people have the right skills, putting your dispute resolution hat on, to come into that environment, I guess, having a minimum standard that's required, which doesn't exist now.
James Judge 25:43
The Adelaide University course that you mentioned, you mentioned it earlier, is that the only place in Australia you can do that adjudication training at that level? Bond doesn't do anything like that, or
Amber Williams 25:55
No, they don't. So it's the only Australian based certification, university based certification. So some of the other universities do have arbitration as a subject, but they don't offer a professional certificate, which is, I think, one of the real strengths of the University of Adelaide. So there are other diplomas that you can get, but they're through international organisations. So they're not Australian based.
James Judge 26:22
Yeah, I knew about the international ones. But yes, that's something also I've learned today. So, Amber, great to talk to you. Thank you so much for joining me today and telling me and the listeners a little bit more about what's happening in the world dispute resolution.
Amber Williams 26:34
No problem. Thanks for having me. It's been fun.
James Judge 26:37
You've been listening to the people and culture podcast with me, James judge. Please subscribe and feel free to share this episode with anyone you feel might get some value from the conversation. Any reviews you leave, wherever you listen to your podcasts are also extremely welcome. If you want to reach out to Amber, probably the best way to do that is through the Resolution Institute website. Just Google resolution institute. Thanks again for your time.
Transcribed by https://otter.ai